"Luckily, the original owner treated the car with Ziebart Rust Protection"

[OBRUT]

gold medal winning ebay prose

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220141079535&ssPageName=ADME:L:LCA:MT:11

[alexwebster]

Brilliant - love how he had two pictures of the glove box, as it is so good!

Could be a good thing to rip the mechanicals out of, wheels etc. Throw the body away, or use it as a tribute to prohart!

[e72phil]

Ziebart eh ? looks like it works really well......

the sticker is about the only thing that seems to have survived.

But it looks like a nice 'fixer-upper"

Right.

[e72phil]

I like the way Bidder 1 has bid himself up from $1000 to $3000.

Guy really knows how ebay works.

[reedminor]

this must have been retrieved from a river or something....

definitely a parts car.... but how sad.

[MrUpwey]

......if only it wasn't a Targa

[bryancra]

So, I have a dumb question about this restoration business. If you require a donor chassis and transplant the VIN numbers, can you really lay claim to the end result being the original car? What actually defines the DNA of a vehicle - I would have thought at minimum it was the chassis....I read Jerry Seinfeld did this the the very first 901 and it caused a bit of a stir....

[griffiths_r]

ah craig, now you have just opened that can of worms again... what is originality? the more you change the less original it is...
how much can you change before it is no longer the car you thought?
My personal opinion is that it is more an issue of percentages...

but far too big a topic to tackle first thing on a sunday morning...

rich

P.S. My dad has the same issue. His 1910 was rebodied in 1930-ish... is it more original to leave it as it is, or to rebody it with a recreation of what it had originally!?

[bryancra]

Mmmmmkay.......either way would have cred me thinks. I'll shut up now.

[griffiths_r]

craig! no, don't shut up!
it's one of those topics that HAS to be contemplated by every restorer... and there are no right answers. i agree with you, it would have some cred... and if all that is different is the chassis... then there is still lots from the original car...

[OBRUT]

very tricky question craig. my personal view is adding a vin plate to a new chassis is a no-no.

i read about 2 cobras turning up to an fia event with the same chassis no. decades earlier, a car was comprehensively wrecked. one guy had bought most of the wrecked chassis and the other most everything else including nearly all of the running gear. both had rebuilt 'their' cars.

it hit the courts and 'chassis' car got to keep the vin and the 'running gear' car had a R (for replica) added to the vin - and was devalued by roughly 90%...

[JDCW72]

A perfect topic for a debate because there is no clearly correct answer.
There is obviously a premium paid for a "matching numbers" vehicle = as it came from the factory. It is reasonable through the life of a classic car that the car may require a change of engine, gearbox, windscreen, oil, etc but to put the VIN plate on to a different chassis, I would see that as changing the identity of the vehicle completely.
I would agree with Ryan. It is unacceptable.

[OBRUT]

and it is much more difficult with tube frame etc race cars which are subject to constant repairs/rebodying etc and which don't have a single (somewhat unitary) component that readily identifies the car like a chassis or tub

gunnar racing restored a 904 that was delivered to them in two pieces - it had split in half after hitting a tree. imagine if each half had gone to a different restorer?

[Andrew B]

What if you engine blows and you need a new case. There goes your 'matching numbers' and value of your car. Or do you do what I suspect is illegal and restamp the block, use the top end and salvagable bits ????

Just for the record, I certainly do not condone restamping of anything! But it is interesting.....

Anyone feeling a little nervous about what theve bought ?

[OBRUT]

"What if you engine blows and you need a new case. There goes your 'matching numbers' and value of your car. "

i think that's correct - you no longer have your originally supplied (and numbered) engine.

stamping the numbers sounds pretty easy - but those star thingys at each end look tough...