France to stop selling petrol/diesel cars

[griffiths_r]

http://www.theage.com.au/world/france-to-end-sale-of-diesel-and-petrol-vehicles-by-2040-20170706-gx6e3x.html?btis

i like the idea... wonder what it means for us 'petrol-heads' and our collections...

[Merv]

Germany will ban combustion engines by 2030. I suspect that they mean new cars. Also Norway has already doubled the road taxes on combustion engines and eliminated them entirely on electric cars. 30% of new cars there are now electric, with free charging provided for the next 10 years.

[green gauge]

People still ride horses, we as petrol heads may be viewed in in the same light as those who are nostalgic and drive for pure enjoyment.
I personally ride a bicycle to work everyday, ture carbon neutral transportation that needs to be embraced. I do 150km+ each week. What exactly is the true cost of mining the rare earth materials to produce an entire fleet of electric vehicles for the whole nation of France, only to shift our carbon emissions to Third World nations that produce our cars and mountains of the ****e we consume in our cosseted lives.

I still drive and when I do I'm propelled by a 2.2t, that I relisise is doing no favors to my personal emission reduction program but burning hydrocarbons this way makes such a wonderful sound which I just couldn't give up at the moment.
I still think shopping and consumption is by far our biggest sin when it comes to emmissons, we simply consumption to much that is transported to far.

[green gauge]

Sorry for rambling, thought this was the pelican parts off topic fourm. I try not to think of environmental issues to much, hurts my head and those around me. Enjoy it while you we can.

[Terminator]

So who is going to fund terrorism now if the oil producing middle east is no longer required.

[Merv]

As the sheik who was OPEC Chairman said, "the Stone Age didn't end because there were no more stones".

[Bremith]

An economy wide price on emissions that reflected their contribution to global warming would be a good idea... oh wait, we had one of them ... now we're governed by utter morons who reject science

IMHO if nothing else the economics of electric vehicles will soon kill fossil fuel powered cars - an engine with 1 moving part, no gearbox, regenerative braking - look how incredible the Tesla model S is - and already FAR cheaper per kilometre to "fuel" than petrol/diesel car, even if you buy 100% green power from grid

in the same way, the rapid fall in battery costs will kill coal AND gas burning power stations - we're already VERY close to the point where a decent sized solar + battery can economically run a house more cheaply than ancient crazy grids running poles and wires thousands of kilometres from a big fossil fuel powered steam boiler and turbine to a house

But I don't see this as a threat to people who want to drive old 911s, other than at some point fuel will get more expensive to reflect (offset) its contribution to global warming

[Merv]

On the money Mitchell. Cobalt batteries are the real future for home installation. One of the major companies is in Brisbane.

[Bremith]

Or - for those to whom it appeals - combine the past with the future:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3A110...ature=youtu.be

http://www.zelectricmotors.com/

IMG_0157.PNG

[SM911]

So who is going to fund terrorism now if the oil producing middle east is no longer required.

So who is going to fund KBR et al now if the oil producing middle east is no longer required.

[Cairns888]

People still ride horses, we as petrol heads may be viewed in in the same light as those who are nostalgic and drive for pure enjoyment.
I personally ride a bicycle to work everyday, ture carbon neutral transportation that needs to be embraced. I do 150km+ each week. What exactly is the true cost of mining the rare earth materials to produce an entire fleet of electric vehicles for the whole nation of France, only to shift our carbon emissions to Third World nations that produce our cars and mountains of the ****e we consume in our cosseted lives.

I still drive and when I do I'm propelled by a 2.2t, that I relisise is doing no favors to my personal emission reduction program but burning hydrocarbons this way makes such a wonderful sound which I just couldn't give up at the moment.
I still think shopping and consumption is by far our biggest sin when it comes to emmissons, we simply consumption to much that is transported to far.

Spot on!!!

[Merv]

There is always cost to change but that cost is not necessarily equated to the cost of no change, which can be much higher financially and environmentally. The environmental economists accurately calculate that there is a major advantage in the change to renewable forms of energy. Not to say that we don't enjoy driving these cars for what they are. Undisputed. The original question was about the future values and utility of our old cars and I can't see that changing as a consequence of international moves to cleaner energy. If you live for any time in Europe you get to well understand their mindset about clean air. I would be happy to have an electric car for most of my local running.

[reedminor]

Yes but to charge these batteries - imagine the power required?

Was speaking to a service manager last week who had his sizeable workshop assessed for the installation of a few commercial grade charging stations.

If he were to install now and switch them all on simultaneously the adjoining buildings would see there power drop to almost nothing.

Yes electric cars are coming but the infrastructure is lagging behind. And doesn't fast charging (in the speed it takes to fill your tank with normal fuel) damage the batteries in long term and shorten their lives.

JR

[Merv]

If power that is substantially renewable is used to recharge the batteries then the important environmental impact is reduced. The current electric cars seem to be rechargeable between 30 mins and 8hrs, depending on the battery size and construction. Connection can also be wireless. Fast charging could reduce battery life, but I suspect that battery warranty periods would give us an indication of that. Fast charging would appear to be the exception/emergency option and longer (overnight) charging the recommended norm. Charging costs now in Europe are about 3 cents/ km.

I am more immediately interested in home batteries to better use the solar generated power I already have. Electricity companies here just keep screwing us. However, an electric car for local trips would seem a great second car option for many of us. In Australia, with relatively poor train fast systems compared to Europe, longer distances such as between where we live to Brisbane would still need a combustion engined car I reckon. For urban dwellers the only car they have may well be electric. Informed governments typically make infrastructure changes attractive (and old technology less attractive) through tax systems, subsidies and rebates for users of new technology. This change is progressive but inevitable it seems. It is about the costs and also about the environmental impact.

[griffiths_r]

All interesting questions... my gut says things are going to change exponentially faster and faster!!

anyways, was thinking more on where's our petrol going to come from... but presumably the petrol/diesel cars sold in 2040 will be on the road until 2070 or so... by which time i won't give a stuff.

other than that, i suspect values will drop... our cars will still be enjoyable and engaging to drive, but less and less people will be bothered with everything that goes along with ownership. (They'll just plug in their VR and Drive any car the care to dream about...)